A CHAT WITH SOPHIE B. HAWKINS

BY KATHERINE CHUNG (SHE/HER) AND LIAM GILLIN (HE/HIM)

Sophie B. Hawkins, the Grammy-nominated singer-songwriter renowned for hits like "Damn, I Wish I Was Your Lover," is making a triumphant return to the UK after almost two decades. Out Jamz, known for its knack in capturing the essence of groundbreaking artists, has secured an exclusive interview with Hawkins in light of her first international performance on the Free Myself Tour. The tour celebrates her acclaimed sixth studio album, "Free Myself," a soul-stirring collection addressing love, resilience, and self-empowerment. Hawkins' impressive career, from chart-topping hits to battling for creative freedom, will unfold in a captivating conversation with Out Jamz, providing fans an intimate insight into the artist's extraordinary journey as an LGBTQ+ artist.

SOPHIE B. HAWKINS | COURTESY OF KEN LAPIERRE

What's the best piece of advice a musician has given you?

Well, I haven't received any advice from a musician per se, and I definitely haven't met all my idols. And you're right. I've been in the business for a long time, starting as an African drummer when I was 14, and then I moved on to Jazz vibraphone Marimba, attending the Manhattan School of Music for percussion. But the best piece of advice I can give to aspiring musicians and songwriters is to focus on the work and not on the industry, because the industry has always been changing. It was something that monks did a couple of hundred years ago. So it will keep changing, and artists tend to get scared that the business won't accept them or won't be a place they can survive. That may or may not be true, but you'll never really be happy unless you focus on your work. And that's what I do every single day. I write songs, I paint, I write stories, books, whatever, and I do all of it on my schedule, not to be in the industry. The industry, I feel, is something that circles back to you. And sometimes you're famous. Like, I've had years and years of incredible success and fame, and then I've had years and years of just working alone without any kind of recognition. And I think they're both important. You learn from all of it.

Coming from that background of visual arts, does your visual creativity influence your music, and do you find that these creative processes affect each other? I'm sorry, I'm like reading off the prompt here.

Yeah, I think it's a really good question. And for me, absolutely. Even though I am a musician who can speak the musical language, write everything out, and as I mentioned, I've been to a music college and a classical college and all that jazz, the best way for me to describe music is visually. When I'm writing a song, it's about finding the chords that fit the mood— that's a visual concept in my head, because the poetry of my lyrics is visual. I've realized that during the writing process, but I don't think about it after the song is done. However, yes, the lyrics are the most important part of any song, I believe. People often talk about how lyrics have changed their lives. The music, as crucial as it is to carry the lyrics, is almost incidental for me. The music brings out the lyrics, and I write everything myself— the music, the lyrics, I make the recordings, my home demos, etc. However, that's the way kids are today, anyway. So, yes, the visual.

By the way, painting coincides with music because both are about space, light, and the moment. When I paint outside, I set the tone, shapes, and the idea, but it's those moments when a blue heron suddenly lands that make you go, "Oh my God, that's the reason I was standing here." It's the same thing, I think, with music and songs.

What is the best piece of advice that you would give your younger self?

The younger self is different for everyone. Some younger people are more focused on the business aspect of music, and it takes a long time to gain the confidence to be a truer artist. On the other hand, some artists, like myself, are more focused on the art and keep thinking the business will come around and handle itself. So, for my younger self, I would have said to be more confident about the business aspect. Unfortunately, that's something that, I think, comes from family and upbringing. It's really hard to teach somebody; they almost have to experience a lot of devastation before realizing they need to take hold of their life and not be used. All artists want so badly to be recognized, and then they find out they've given too much away at a certain point, or they are in the habit of giving too much away. So it's hard to teach that. But to say, maybe take a few hours every week to focus on the business aspect is what I would have said to my younger self. But it wouldn't have worked, mind you, because young people don't listen, and that's why they're great.

“Free Myself,” You’ve returned to the music scene after a hiatus. What aspects of the music industry have evolved during your break, and how have these changes influenced your approach to releasing music?

Well, that's a really good question too. I want to mention that the people who represent me might call it a hiatus, but I was actually writing, working, still gigging, and trying to get my music out there. Due to changes in the music industry, I couldn't find the right way. So I wasn't purposefully taking a break. Just so you know, the month my daughter was born, I was on stage performing, showing pictures of her. That's just the truth of it. However, it's fine to say it looks like a hiatus. Who cares in the end? I will say the changes are that it's become impossible to make money unless you have ginormous touring. By the way, this was true even in the middle, like '98, when I left Sony and became an independent artist on purpose. I left them because I saw that I had a choice to either survive as an independent artist or be completely at the mercy of a commercial company that wouldn't support the artist. Whether I survived or not was just a matter of numbers. So I chose to fight for my work, sued the label Sony to get my masters back, and did get my current album back, re-releasing it. Since then, I've been an independent artist, supporting my whole family with my music. That's good. But what I will say is that increasingly since the '90s, it's become difficult to make money as any kind of artist unless you're a ginormous artist with ginormous ticket sales. And that, as we can see, is rare because even the biggest artists are teaming up with other big artists just to keep record sales. So how is the up-and-coming versioning artist going to survive? That's a question that hasn't been answered yet. So the digital age is not artist-friendly. Maybe you can get your music out there, but the biggest problem is, who cares? Everyone's getting the music out there. AI is getting just as much music out there on some weeks as artists. So how's the artist going to differentiate themselves and become important and artists of consequence? The answer is, I don't know. But as I said before, the work is so important to me. It's really my breath, and my life is to be noticed. So I'm going to keep doing the work and hopefully the industry will circle back. Artists will figure out how to get their rights back in the digital sphere because all the rights were bought up without anyone noticing, really. It's kind of incredible. I think Taylor Swift is a good example of a person who stood up and said no often to these problems. Listen. That's right. Spotify, before, only paid 0.6 of a cent per stream, so we weren't making any money anyway. Now, to be making less, in a way, all artists have to sort of hold their art and boycott. But then the truth is, all an artist wants to do is get their music out there. That's how the exchange works. It's a really manipulative thing, and I think it's age-old. It's this age-old manipulation of the artist, where art is the thing that transforms our society the fastest. Right. It's what gives information the fastest to people, to be courageous, to be new, to be different. And that's why we're talking about LGBTQ+ in music because what better channel than music to change the world?

How do you see the future of the music industry, especially with the changes of technology and how people advocate for LGBTQ rights through the social media?

Yeah, everything is on social media. That is definitely something you asked about during this period of mine when I was having trouble getting a record out—what changed? Everything is on social media, and yet people don't make any money from social media unless you have advertising. So, how do you survive that? I think you mentioned it's the live performances. Live performances must be the key, and they used to be the key. So, the way is live performances, then merchandise at your live shows, and then any platform that really pays you for live performances. Maybe artists have to take a stand and say, "I won't do this platform, but I'll do this one because this one actually pays." This is something that outshines, maybe even has a visual platform. I'm not sure, but it could be this consciousness-raising effort, this community. We're only all going to survive by communities anyway, with AI coming and taking over, which apparently there are so many books about. If you've read some of them, like the coming wave, it's just frightening. It seems the only way to survive, even as a human, let alone an artist, is to have a very strong community.

What do you hope listeners take away from your music?

I do hope listeners take away a part of themselves that's awakened. I hope they feel like my music is a friend they've met, someone who shows them something about themselves, sparking a desire to start awakening more and delve deeper. That's what I hope, and I feel that's what I've heard. The best compliments are when people say, "Your music has represented this," and "Your music was a comfort to me at a time of that." It's always a transition, a change, and a development. So I feel good because that's what it is for me. I write, as I mentioned, to survive, but also to grow. My songs are my teachers—they're my higher self, and they come into my being. It's almost like a sort of wisdom from truly a higher self, and we all have a higher self. So I'm hoping that it is for other people as it is for me.